4 thoughts on “Was Panorama’s Presenter right about Corbynomics? | Think Left

  1. Wow, why don’t you, John ‘D’ Turner really tell us what you think??
    BTW I went to a selective grammar school, as did many working class kids, because it was what happened 50-60 years ago, when everyone sat the 11 plus, and some of us went to grammar school. We were so poor I got a special grant for my school uniform, as did several others in my year. Other parents scraped to afford it, and were so proud. We all knew we might go to uni, because when we passed our A levels, there was a grant system, otherwise I for one would not have been able to go. My mother was able to become a teacher, having a grant as a mature student, in her 30’s, single parent. I also studied for PhD, again with a full grant. I became a scientific researcher (workedon brining new antibiotics into production) andthen lecturer, teaching many undergrads & post grads. They cam from all back grounds, and one of my favourites was a middle-aged nun (in habit!), who also had a grant. I left lecturing when the FHEsector was reorganised by Maggie, and then by Blair to become warehousing money-making operations, offering a second-rate education in exchange for life-time debts, and the exclusion of more working class. Anyone who complains about a free education “favouring the middle classes” is divorced from reality, and has a serious emotional reaction to something that the rest of the world is belatedly copying from the UK and nordic states. Even in the US they are now offering free higher education at some state unis. Last night I saw a Syrian refugee, who was a Vet, who wanted to go to Germany because he would be able to continue advanced studies. My own brother has settled in a scandinavian country and has qualified, as a mature student with 2 younf children for a full grant that has taken him through a BSc and now an MSc, with hope of a PhD, none of which would be possible in the UK.

    You are a typical slash & burn commenter. You seriously mis-understand the policies that are being proposed for discussion by Corbyn (note, doscussion, not the usual presidential hand-down style or Tories and New Labour). You rail against the policies you wrongly think are for the white male middle class, and fail to see that unless we have a complete change to the economic system, to dump austerity in the bin, and start to rebuild our industrial base, then we have no hope at all.

    BUt I suspect you actually are a UKIP supporter, so really there’s nothing anyone can say to change your mind. Unlike Corbyns supporters, who are open to discussion, new ideas, compromise, and above all equality.

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    • Equality? What about equality of opportunity post 18 for all and not just those from middle and higher income backgrounds? Corbyn’s apologists are seeking to defend the indefensible whilst praying in aid the working class. They are seeking to justify why people on the National Minimum Wage should see their taxes go to people who will have better lives thereby. You are middle class going by your life history.

      The demand for a degree through the traditional route is price inelastic. We have the evidence for that assertion because of the willingness of those who are currently paying their fees to pay said fees. They reckon that the return on their investment is worth the cost of their tuition. I would take Corbyn seriously, if he were talking about increasing the overall number of university places and providing effective support to get young people from low income backgrounds to university admissions interviews, but he is not. The matter of the cost of the fees is just a smokescreen. The same smokescreen as deployed by the SNP:

      http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/features/the-snp-has-failed-scotland

      As an aside, ever thought our society and economy are in the state they are in due to our system of higher education which elevates three year academic courses over all other forms of education and learning, academic and vocational? What Germany and many other countries do have are educational systems that do not elevate the traditional route to a degree over alternative routes and vocational qualifications. Corbyn’s free university tuition fees policy and his risible National Education Service will further entrench the prejudices that already exist within UK society.

      Prejudices that favour, amongst others, Jeremy Corbyn’s own constituents in Islington. 61.8% of those of working age in Islington North have at least an NVQ4 or equivalent, the figure for Great Britain is 36.0% and in a typical Labour constituency, which Islington North is most certainly not, Birmingham Hodge Hill the percentage is 15.7%. No wonder da yoof of Islington have come out in droves for Corbyn.

      Corbyn’s policy ideas will not build on our existing (manufacturing?) industrial base. Currently, the UK is the 10th largest goods exporter in the world and manufactured goods make up 44% of our exports:

      https://jodatu.wordpress.com/2015/04/07/uks-healthy-manufacturing-sector-meaningful-manual-labour-other-myths-ge2015-racefornumber10/

      If Corbyn wins the leadership of the Labour Party then you will have your opportunity to go door to door, canvassing for votes, explaining why the least well off in our society should pay for Cameron’s son and Corbyn’s children to go to university at their expense and for free. And some of those voters, whose votes Labour will need to win elections from May 2016 onwards, will be amongst the 3,881,099 who voted ukip on 7th May 2015. I think going around, like the typical middle class leftie, smugly saying you are better than them:

      “BUt (sic) I suspect you actually are a UKIP supporter, so really there’s nothing anyone can say to change your mind. Unlike Corbyns supporters, who are open to discussion, new ideas, compromise, and above all equality.”

      will prove to be unhelpful to say the least. Corbyn’s supporters do not want debate or compromise. Corbyn’s leadership will just be another variation on the conviction politics of Thatcher and Blair.

      I am in no way a ukip supporter, but it is instructive to note your reaction in that regard. However, at least I, unlike you it seems, know what will put ukip supporters off voting Labour, but then I regularly campaign for the party, year in and year out. Incidentally, there is a wealth of research into why we lost in May:

      https://jodatu.wordpress.com/2015/08/12/response-to-the-corbyn-phenomenon/

      Perhaps you might practice what you preach, be open minded and actually read some of it?

      Thank you for “You seriously mis-understand the policies that are being proposed for discussion by Corbyn”. Firstly, does that mean I, as a fully paid up member of the Labour Party, may get to vote against policies like free university tuition fees? Secondly, are we talking about an inclusive approach to policy making or just getting to vote on documents like Corbyn’s Northern Future which is a very poor example of effective consultation. Yes, I do him the justice of reading his policy documents.

      And thank you for trying to patronise me. I may not have a degree, but I have over 27 years experience in labour market issues, unlike Corbyn and seemingly a lot of his supporters. Corbyn’s approach to labour market issues, like that of that of IDS, is supply side focused. One excuses Corbyn for taking that approach, given that he has spent forty years doing and achieving nothing at taxpayer’s expense, but one expects better of those who are so quick to flaunt their academic qualifications. One might almost think they have to do so, because, without their paper qualifications to play as a trump card, their arguments seem flimsy, even to them.

      And, while I have your attention, why does Corbyn refer to £80 billion of tax evasion? Is not tax evasion a middle class euphemism for tax fraud?

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    • I had an e-mail from Team Jeremy (reaches for sick bag) in which I am told Corbyn is for “straight-talking, honest politics”. I took him at his word so may I take “really tell us what you think” as a compliment?

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  2. I think the Corbynettes are going to have to get used to the fact that not everyone believes St Jeremy walks on water or else they will all be dead of apoplexy before Christmas.

    Sooner or later, someone is going to point out to the (mostly middle class) fans of Jeremy Corbyn that just because, some 50 years ago, a middle class, ex grammar school boy fancied playing the part of the working class rebel (with many fashionable causes) it does not make him, 50 years later, a tribune of the people. He is, and always will be, the standard bearer of Islington Man and Woman.

    One only has to look at the policies Corbyn has campaigned on in seeking votes from Labour Party’s mostly male, mostly white, mostly middle class, mostly public sector managerial employed selectorate to see how narrow his appeal will be outside of that bubble. For example, anyone concerned about the quality of public transport experienced by the many and not the few would be talking about bus not rail.

    And no one, concerned about equal opportunities for all post 18 would have launched his or her campaign by pledging to lift the burden of university fees off the offspring of mostly middle and upper parents. Only one third of young people go to university now, and no more would under a Corbyn led Government. Still, at least the Corbynettes would have the satisfaction of knowing they had campaigned for David Cameron’s son to go to Oxford University for free.

    I, for one, will not deliver any leaflets containing references to Corbyn’s free university tuition fees policy. The bright, shiny Corbynettes of the revivalist meetings are welcome to that privilege in the ward, one of the most deprived in England, in which I campaign. As it happens, me and mine come from that ward.

    In short, Corbyn is as much of a poseur in his way as Farage is in his. Alas, for the Corbynettes, the working class warm more to Farage, a graduate of Dulwich College, founded in 1617, than they do to Corbyn, who attended the private Castle House School and then Adams’ Grammar School, a selective boy’s school founded in 1656 by William Adams, a wealthy member of the Worshipful Company of Haberdashers. No wonder Corbyn does not do personal.

    Incidentally, I went to a very good Comprehensive School and I do not care who knows it!

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